IRC log started Mon May 31 00:00:01 1999
[msg(TUNES)] permlog 1999.0531
-:- SignOff _ruiner_: #TUNES (Leaving)
-:- NetSplit: koontz.openprojects.net split from sterling.openprojects.net [02:24am]
-:- BitchX+Deb1an: Press Ctrl-F to see who left Ctrl-E to change to [koontz.openprojects.net]
-:- Netjoined: koontz.openprojects.net sterling.openprojects.net
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<Beholder> Hello all, if you're here
09:20am
-:- SignOff Beholder: #TUNES (Read error to Beholder[ppp-004.m4-1.osh.ican.net]: EOF from client)
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<hcf> anyone one awake?
<hcf> anyone awake?
-:- hcf has changed the topic on channel #Tunes to: TUNES http:www.tunes.org || docs http://bespin.tunes.org/~qz/borg.qzx.com || jmc http://www-formal.stanford.edu/jmc/index.html
01:20pm
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<Tv> On your Wiki you mention that the WikiNamingPolicy annoys you. I have a patch for that, want it?
<Tv> (I'm assuming you run AtisWiki, which it looks like)
<hcf> Tv: talk to tril about that, when he de-idles
<Tv> Ok.
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01:50pm
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<hcf> oh hmm
02:40pm
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<john1> hello
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<hcf> hoy
03:30pm
-:- HickServ [thrustit@209-68-229-147.dialup.cust.tfb.com] has joined #tunes
<HickServ> ahoy
<HickServ> blarg
<HickServ> screw this
03:50pm
-:- SignOff HickServ: #TUNES (later)
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<bugbyte> wtf is tunes?
-:- SignOff bugbyte: #TUNES (I wish I was special, your so fucking special... but Im a creep...)
04:50pm
!netgod:*! lackey is rebooting -- scsi subsystem blew up
!drow:*! Actually, lackey is rebooting, quake blew up.
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<_QZ> oh my god, x11amp is using 70meg
<_QZ> of memory
<AlonzoTG> hehe
05:10pm
<_QZ> i have E+gnome, netscape, couple gnome terminals, x11amp and xchat open and im using 192meg ram and 88meg swap
<_QZ> wow x11amp has a memory leak, i can sit here and watch its mem usage climb
<_QZ> 1meg per minute
-:- SignOff hcf: #TUNES (Ping timeout for hcf[me-portland-us903.javanet.com])
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05:20pm
<_QZ> hcf: what do u think the X resource name for netscapes email list box would be called?
<hcf> dunno
05:30pm
-:- SignOff Tril: #TUNES (Ping timeout for Tril[sloth.wcug.wwu.edu])
-:- Tril [dem@sloth.wcug.wwu.edu] has joined #TUNES
-:- mode/#Tunes [+o Tril] by ChanServ
-:- HickServ [thrustit@209-68-229-90.dialup.cust.tfb.com] has joined #tunes
<HickServ> hello
<HickServ> hey how does an os interface with a driver
<HickServ> i know little about drivers
06:10pm
<HickServ> hello?
<AlonzoTG> dependz on da os
<HickServ> well linux
<AlonzoTG> u know of the /dev/ directory?
<AlonzoTG> Unix and DOS support eggzacktile 2 types of devices...
<AlonzoTG> Blok and Charactor...
<AlonzoTG> Each device driver is presented to the user as a file that can be read from and written to...
<AlonzoTG> many devices also support a set of interfaces called "IOCTRL"
<AlonzoTG> which allows the manipulation of the metadata of that stream such as baud rate and other aspects...
<AlonzoTG> =)
<HickServ> uh huh
<HickServ> i look at linux kernel source but it looks like a bunch of functions
<HickServ> nothing more
<HickServ> i mean linux drvier source
<HickServ> sorry
<AlonzoTG> the os doesn't really interface with the driver, it allows programs to interface with the driver...
<AlonzoTG> =\
<AlonzoTG> I am not a LiNuKs Sourcerer.....
-:- Beholder [beholder@ppp-051.m4-1.osh.ican.net] has joined #tunes
<AlonzoTG> hehe
* AlonzoTG/#tunes greets "Salutations Beholder!" :-)
<Beholder> Hey guys
<AlonzoTG> Lo and ....
<HickServ> hello beholder
<AlonzoTG> =>
<Beholder> So, how goes this fine night with you two?
<AlonzoTG> bitchin...
<HickServ> fine thankyou
<HickServ> i need you to help me with drivers beholder
<AlonzoTG> so what did you drag your nick in here for?
<Beholder> Hick:  I see that I eloquently said "hi" to you in the Tunes m-list, sorry about not recognizing you ;)
<HickServ> i don't know what to do with em with an os
<Beholder> Alon:  What kind of help do you need?
06:20pm
<AlonzoTG> mental
<AlonzoTG> psycheatric
<HickServ> help me !!!
<HickServ> i need driver help
<Beholder> Sorry Hick, just noticed it was you who wanted help ;)  (damn tiny fonts... I think I need glasses... damn)
<HickServ> :)
<Beholder> What kind of help do you need?
<HickServ> well i know how to interface with the hardware i just don't know what the hell an os does with them
<HickServ> drivers
<Beholder> Usually they provide a type of API for software to access the hardware in a unified type way
<HickServ> but they're compliled
-:- billyboof [hatefull@nrwc-sh14-port218.snet.net] has joined #tunes
<Beholder> You must provide a way for them to stay in memory :)
<billyboof> hello
<Beholder> Hello 
<abi> hello, Beholder
<HickServ> um
* Beholder/#tunes bows to the bot
<HickServ> mabye i shall ask billy
<Beholder> If you wish :)
<billyboof> whats up hick?
<HickServ> drivers
<Beholder> Alon:  What have you been working on lately?
<HickServ> how does an os use drivers as an api if they're compiled
<AlonzoTG> B00F!!!!
<AlonzoTG> I am sorta vegatating... :((
<AlonzoTG> contemplating my navel...
<AlonzoTG> Feling copius ammounts of self-pitty...
<AlonzoTG> not doing anything...
<AlonzoTG> feeling more self pitty...
<billyboof> umm....
<billyboof> depends... you can do it a few different ways...
-:- SignOff hcf: #TUNES (Leaving)
<Beholder> Alon:  You into game development?
<billyboof> regardless you will need to have an executable format with multiple entry points...
06:30pm
<AlonzoTG> yes 
<AlonzoTG> I was thinking of game development today while playing this stupid old game feeling even more self pitty...
<Beholder> Alon:  Do you have any experience with VC++ and DirectX programming?
<AlonzoTG> no
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<Beholder> Alon:  Damn... am I the only one trying to learn this?!  You're the 10th person whos into game development that hasn't even touched DirectX...  Geze... either I'm wrong learning DirectX... or everyone knows something I dont ;)
<billyboof> hick: i'll have to talk to you about it more some other time... i just came online to get my email... i need to sleep though... later..
<HickServ> :(
<billyboof> maybe tomorrow.. i just got back from canada and i'
<HickServ> i need to know what the hell to do with drivers
<Beholder> Hick:  What specifically are you looking for?  
<HickServ> ok
<HickServ> uh
<billyboof> ... i'm hungover really bad...
<HickServ> well im planing ahead for my os
<Beholder> I live in canada
<billyboof> really?   where?  i went to monteal..
-:- LaGgEr_ [x@pool022-max7.ds12-ca-us.dialup.earthlink.net] has joined #Tunes
<Beholder> A little to the left and south... Toronto area
<LaGgEr_> Hello
<Beholder> Hello Lag
<billyboof> ahhh.... oh well... need to make it to work tomorrow... so off to bed i go...
-:- SignOff billyboof: #TUNES (hatefull@antisocial.com)
<Beholder> Hick:  What format of executable are you making?  (home grown?)
<HickServ> oh
<HickServ> well yes
<Beholder> If you're making the OS yourself, and the drivers, then if they are executable, you make your kernel put them in any ol portion of memory, and you have a driver table in memory (usually like a dictionary).  When a program or kernel wishes to access the device, it will lookup the proper driver name/symbol in memory and jump to it's location in memory and execute the function.... at least that's the way it works with .SYS files in DOS
<AlonzoTG> =
<AlonzoTG> )
<Beholder> The executable may just tell the kernel that it's a driver... or do the driverLoad function or something...
<AlonzoTG> Dos: The OS that makes me =)
<HickServ> beholder: ok that makes sense
<Beholder> You like dos? :)  So do I :)
<AlonzoTG> the kernel has to police those drivers...
<AlonzoTG> nuke bogies...
<HickServ> dos is ok
<HickServ> i guess
* AlonzoTG/#tunes IS running IBM PC-DOS 7.0
06:40pm
<Beholder> Hey, you put dos on a 8086 XT machine and I can bet you that it's working to 100% efficency... it's 100% reflective and is using every piece of hardware to it's maximum :)
<HickServ> i like dr-dos
<HickServ> but i've never used it :)
<Beholder> Hick:  About that driver thing... I think Win95 does it a bit differently.... as does Linux... do you want to hear thier spiel?
<Beholder>  Actually... for Linux there are no drivers really... just a great big kick ass kernel... or kernel extensions
<AlonzoTG> the driverz are kompiled into the kernel...
<AlonzoTG> =\
<Beholder> Alon:  Just out of curiosity, what kind of game dev are you interested in?  (genre type)
<AlonzoTG> adventure/simulation...
<AlonzoTG> minimal kombat...
<AlonzoTG> DOS
<AlonzoTG> Hero's Quest!!!!!!!!
<AlonzoTG> So YOU want to be a hero?
<Beholder> Hero's Quest was awesome... can't wait till they get that new one out
<Beholder> But you'll have to be running 95/98 to play it
<AlonzoTG> =~(
<Beholder> Alon:  Ever think about RPG type games?
06:50pm
<HickServ> do you guys think prostitution is bad?
<HickServ> i think it is ok
<Beholder> Prostitiution?  Hmm... it's a pretty old profession, even if we think it's bad, I don't think they can get rid of it ;)
<HickServ> i mean should it be legal?
<Beholder> If it were leagal it would be regulated, that would be a very good thing.  No more 12 year old crack addicts.... that would make me accept it.
<HickServ> yeah
<HickServ> and you would need a liceanse
<HickServ> be tested for std's
<Beholder> Yep, and be tested, and you'd have to be part of a group or something...
<_QZ> HickServ: u saying u cant get laid so u need to pay to get some but u dont wanna be breakin the law? :)
<HickServ> well yes
<Beholder> QZ:  Been there eh? :)
<HickServ> i don't wanna get laid at 14 years old
<_QZ> Beholder: most hookers are part of a group. there's the pimp and all the hookers under him :)
<HickServ> i'l wait
<Beholder> QZ:  I meant more of a licenced brothel or something
<LaGgEr_> Does TunesOS boot?
<Beholder> There is no TunesOS ;)
<HickServ> im gonna write a report for school about it
<AlonzoTG> Lets make something and call it tunes...
07:00pm
-:- LaGgEr_ [x@pool022-max7.ds12-ca-us.dialup.earthlink.net] has left #Tunes []
<HickServ> im writing BuenOS
<HickServ> BuenOS?
<abi> rumour has it BuenOS is almost as cool and Mr. Clean
<HickServ> damn straight
<Beholder> Let's steal BRiX and call it Tunes ... hehehe 
<HickServ> lol
<HickServ> YES!
<HickServ> that will piss the hell out of qz
<Beholder> Actually, just seeing if he's still online ;)
07:10pm
-:- SignOff _QZ: #TUNES (Read error to _QZ[p0wer.qzx.com]: EOF from client)
<Beholder> Well, I'm off to sleep, gotta work tomorrow :)
-:- Beholder [beholder@ppp-051.m4-1.osh.ican.net] has left #tunes []
<AlonzoTG> om
<HickServ> oomm
07:20pm
* HickServ/#tunes is superior to Alonzo
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* AlonzoTG/#tunes greets "Salutations shadow!" :-)
<HickServ> i really need to shower
<HickServ> tell me about dynamic loading and unloading of drivers
-:- _QZ [brand@p0wer.qzx.com] has joined #tunes
<HickServ> hey q what up?
<shadow> si
<shadow> yes
<HickServ> nevemind
<HickServ> AlonzoTG?
<abi> AlonzoTG is lame
<AlonzoTG> om
<HickServ> oh my
<HickServ> probably hcf
<HickServ> HickServ?
<abi> well, HickServ is the father of BuenOS and is chicano too or part of the Sicilian Mafia
<AlonzoTG> I'm lame cuz I gotta be!
<AlonzoTG> =\
<HickServ> tell me about dynamic loading and unloading of drivers
<AlonzoTG> hmm...
07:40pm
<AlonzoTG> seems simple...
<AlonzoTG> In my OS a driver is simply added to the list of available drivers...
<HickServ> abi: no, Alonzo is my sicilian mafia under boss
<abi> okay, HickServ.
<HickServ> uh
<AlonzoTG> then people can then access my driver. =)
<HickServ> that isn't anything special
<HickServ> that's what i was thinking about doing
<AlonzoTG> Then to unload it everybody who has accessed the driver is notified...
<AlonzoTG> Its all a question of maintaining data structures and providing functions...
<AlonzoTG> That is all elementry programming...
<AlonzoTG> what is not elementry programming is linking programs to those functions...
<AlonzoTG> I could write my OS right now if I had a way to link stuff... =(
<HickServ> i see now what you mean by linking
<HickServ> ask the masters i.e. the tunes crew
<_QZ> in brix u access drivers the same way u access a dll
07:50pm
<HickServ> well some of us don't know how to access a dll :|
<_QZ> uhh
<_QZ> do u know howto use C?
<HickServ> yes
<_QZ> do u know howto use printf()?
<HickServ> yes
<_QZ> then u know howt ouse brix drivers
<HickServ> im letting people ph34r me bye converting binary to hex in my head
<_QZ> uhh
<_QZ> any1 can convert binary to hex in their head
<HickServ> they don't know that
<_QZ> but can u convert decimal to octal in yer head? :)
<HickServ> nah
<HickServ> i don't remember
<HickServ> do tell
<HickServ> i can do binary to octal
<HickServ> that's easy too
<HickServ> i think i can do octal t ohex
<AlonzoTG> I'm sick of motherboards...
<AlonzoTG> Every few years I am buying a new motherboard...
<AlonzoTG> What I have decided to do is buy a passive packplane and putting in a SBC. =)
<AlonzoTG> I won't have to replace it untill someone invents a new bus.
08:00pm
<HickServ> what's the best way to generate random numbers in c?
<AlonzoTG> call the PIII random number instruction.
<HickServ> um
<HickServ> im on a 486
<AlonzoTG> =\
<AlonzoTG> just use the random(); func
<HickServ> mabye qz knows
<HickServ> huh?
<HickServ> what library?
<AlonzoTG> stdlib
<HickServ> what is the syntax?
<AlonzoTG> uh
<AlonzoTG> I'd hafto look it up...
<HickServ> i'll  so it
<HickServ> thanks
<HickServ> im writing a base converting teaching program
<HickServ> pointless freeware
<AlonzoTG> int rand(void);
08:10pm
<AlonzoTG> thazit
<HickServ> uh
<HickServ> how does it know what the max size to make the return?
-:- SignOff HickServ: #TUNES (Leaving)
08:20pm
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-:- HickServ [thrustit@209-68-229-172.dialup.cust.tfb.com] has joined #tunes
<HickServ> hey how is the os supposed to know the address and parameters of each function in the device drivers?
<HickServ> hurry now
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09:10pm
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<lar1> hey
<hcf> hoy, lar1
10:20pm
<lar1> whats the difference between the GX and BX chipset?
10:30pm
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<hcf> hoy _ruiner_
<_ruiner_> whats up hcf?
<_ruiner_> haven't talked to you in a long time
<_QZ> hello
<abi> hoy, _QZ
<hcf> _ruiner_: nothing, u?
<_ruiner_> nada
11:40pm
<_ruiner_> hmmmmmm
<_ruiner_> anybody gonna talk?
11:50pm
[msg(TUNES)] newlog 1999.0601
IRC log ended Tue Jun  1 00:00:00 1999